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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6679
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Been something I've been badgering the guys on Skype about. While I love the idea of Legion, it kind of angers me that we're pouring so much effort into a game that would be Dust 514 as it was intended (let alone without being green lit) and abandoning the game that is actually pulling revenue, at least as far as active development goes.
Considering the sheer lack of communication and status updates about Legion, I'm starting to get the impression that it didn't get green lit/is still up in the air... Which, I can't help but wonder what you do with an entire development team that went off to make a game without 100% authorization from the higher ups.
Do they drop Legion all together and essentially have wasted an entire year of development to come back to Dust 514? Do they take the White Wolf - World of Darkness route and just fade away..?
Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold.
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6679
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:I really hope it isn't going to development hell.
Do we have any reason to believe that it hasn't..?
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6679
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
Blueprint For Murder wrote:They said items, sp, and isk would be transferable so I am not worried. While the new features that will be added in legion are epic the most important thing is re-branding even if it was Dust 2 with some proper marketing. They have the best fps here and once everyone hears some buzz it is going to blow up. I would be a little disappointed if it was not on ps4 I need a reason to buy one.
Did you even read the OP O.o??
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This player has reached their breaking point
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:29:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:-Snip-
You have to kind of wonder why the bloody hell any of us should even buy the BPOs/Boosters anymore when we don't know that the revenue is being put into anything that contributes to the longevity of the game we're playing, be it on the PS3 or on the PC.
And as far as the CPM whispering sweet nothings in our ear about Project Legion - bear in mind that the CPM 0 for the longest time had a rather hopeful outlook on their faces up until the Project Legion announcement at Fanfest; when the curtain was pulled to reveal the nebulous concept that, "Hey, we've -TECHNICALLY- been doing development!". So, I'd take that as a grain of salt because (like just about everything else) there's very little to show for it as proof.
To be completely honest, if I were an investor, I'd be kinda pissed at the whole situation. As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Why should I invest in something that I have no idea is being put to good use, despite simply being told (repeatedly I might add) that it -is- being put to good use?
Just assume for a second that Project Legion -did not- get green lit... That development for both Legion and Dust 514 has been cancelled. What good does it do to spend money on it? That's the assumption I have until I see something concrete.
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This player has reached their breaking point
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:You have to kind of wonder why the bloody hell any of us should even buy the BPOs/Boosters anymore when we don't know that the revenue is being put into anything that contributes to the longevity of the game we're playing, be it on the PS3 or on the PC. Then don't spend money on a game with the mindset that it must exist 1 year from now. Ask yourself, "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?" If the answer is yes, then buy whatever it is. If it is no, then don't. Take this advice and you will enjoy gaming a great deal more. Aeon Amadi wrote:And as far as the CPM whispering sweet nothings in our ear about Project Legion - bear in mind that the CPM 0 for the longest time had a rather hopeful outlook on their faces up until the Project Legion announcement at Fanfest; when the curtain was pulled to reveal the nebulous concept that, "Hey, we've -TECHNICALLY- been doing development!". So, I'd take that as a grain of salt because (like just about everything else) there's very little to show for it as proof. Familiarize yourself with this legal concept.Aeon Amadi wrote:To be completely honest, if I were an investor, I'd be kinda pissed at the whole situation. As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Why should I invest in something that I have no idea is being put to good use, despite simply being told (repeatedly I might add) that it -is- being put to good use?]/quote]See above: "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?"
[quote=Aeon Amadi]Just assume for a second that Project Legion -did not- get green lit... That development for both Legion and Dust 514 has been cancelled. What good does it do to spend money on it? That's the assumption I have until I see something concrete. Spending money on it should add something resembling entertainment to your life. Stop caring about what CCP does with the that money and start caring about if your purchase will add enjoyment to your weekends.
Well if we're expected to take that advice, let's all just go play more worthy games and let this one die off in peace, lol.
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Well if we're expected to take that advice, let's all just go play more worthy games and let this one die off in peace, lol. If you really feel that way then head off to greener pastures I'm still having fun playing Dust 514 and I want to see where this Legion thing is going, so I'm going to stick around.
And if it doesn't go anywhere?
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
Immortal John Ripper wrote:Kevall Longstride wrote:
'CPM1 tells us that Legion is still under development'
We say this because we've not heard anything to the contrary. If we had, we'd be unable say so because of the NDA.
so if legion is redlight, you can't even tell us?!?! While CCP may push more aurum sales to us? I am sure this has to be some kind of typo or momentary error in logic. #IHATENDA
Sounds strikingly similar to what happened right before Fanfest 2014, eh?
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[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kevall Longstride wrote:Immortal John Ripper wrote:Kevall Longstride wrote:
'CPM1 tells us that Legion is still under development'
We say this because we've not heard anything to the contrary. If we had, we'd be unable say so because of the NDA.
so if legion is redlight, you can't even tell us?!?! While CCP may push more aurum sales to us? I am sure this has to be some kind of typo or momentary error in logic. #IHATENDA Of course we couldn't tell you. We signed an NDA. That said, I think if we stopped talking or answering questions about it, you could make a pretty good guess as to its status.
So what's the hold up..? Why keep absolutely silent - haven't we already come to the conclusion a billion times over that silence can lead to nothing but bad things?
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6680
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 13:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
NextDark Knight wrote:I know this hurts most people.. but I'm not looking forward to the aim bots on PC.
Won't be much different then Destiny's ridiculous aim assist.
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[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6709
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Posted - 2014.10.16 01:00:00 -
[10] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Been something I've been badgering the guys on Skype about. While I love the idea of Legion, it kind of angers me that we're pouring so much effort into a game that would be Dust 514 as it was intended (let alone without being green lit) and abandoning the game that is actually pulling revenue, at least as far as active development goes.
Considering the sheer lack of communication and status updates about Legion, I'm starting to get the impression that it didn't get green lit/is still up in the air... Which, I can't help but wonder what you do with an entire development team that went off to make a game without 100% authorization from the higher ups.
Do they drop Legion all together and essentially have wasted an entire year of development to come back to Dust 514? Do they take the White Wolf - World of Darkness route and just fade away..?
Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold. Aeon, bro, first let me say that it is good to see you around again and reiterate my offer to start catching some squads Second let me ask you this Why So Serious?While explicit details are beyond the scope of what is allowed by the NDA in this context I can say this much When I was elected CPM I had no intention of spending another dime in Dust 514. However as recently as this month I purchased the largest AUR pack with no trepidation.Make of that what you will, but you've known me for awhile man and while nothing in gaming - or life - is ever secure or certain not really I'd like to think you know by now that I do not make my choices without consideration and reason. Will my reasons always match everyone elses? Of course not because no one can legitimately claim that is true, but here is something that is true due to my interactions with the CCP Dust team I went from casual play status back to capping out at least one character every week. Could something still go wrong? Sure, something could always still go wrong this is life so I am not pretending otherwise but I can simply and bluntly say that this is the most confidence I have had in the Dust team since sometime in closed beta. Here is something else that is true, the more support - and yes of course this includes spending money on the game - that Dust gets the better the chances of a positive outcome. The less support - which also includes active players and constructive actionable feedback - the game gets the lower the chances of a positive outcome. I realize that is pretty much basic reasoning, but it is also - simply put - the heart of the matter. In the end, everyone makes their own choices based on what they want to see happen. 0.02 ISK Cross EDIT: PS ~ I still strongly believe in communication between CCP and the Community and heartily support the notion of there being more information supplied with regards to development generally and Legion specifically. That being said I also give credit where it is due, Logibro and Rattati have made substantial strides in community interaction/involvement in the hotfix process and IMO we as players (especially those of us who've been around long enough to contract 'bitter vet' syndrome) should not let the past mistakes of others overshadow the current accomplishments of the guys working Dust development now.
The problem here is you have inside information that we don't (and from the looks of things likely won't until Fanfest). Asking to support a game/franchise that we know nothing about with a developer that's proven only to be reliable at changing course every-time there's a new EP, to us, sounds like a horrible and terrible investment and you honestly can't expect anyone to do it based solely on hope.
I'll bring Destiny in as an example: People were pre-ordering that game before it even had screenshots and gameplay video... All it had was concept art and three paragraphs describing (essentially) Borderlands. Just as well, they were taking pre-orders on 'next gen consoles' before those consoles were even announced. However, people still pre-ordered the ever living **** out of it because it was being developed by Bungie (reputable for the Halo franchise) and published by Activision (Call of Duty). They knew that whatever this game was, it was going to be quality.
How wrong they were.
The point of the matter though is that CCP doesn't have that kind of reputation as either a developer or a publisher, so taking those kind of chances just doesn't work. To me, it seems they're writing marketing checks their studio can't cash. We -NEED- something to go off of if they want our investment and they need our investment if they want to continue developing something for us to go off of. The key difference here is that we don't have anything to lose from this little cold war of information.
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6709
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 01:06:00 -
[11] - Quote
Forlorn Destrier wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Been something I've been badgering the guys on Skype about. While I love the idea of Legion, it kind of angers me that we're pouring so much effort into a game that would be Dust 514 as it was intended (let alone without being green lit) and abandoning the game that is actually pulling revenue, at least as far as active development goes.
Considering the sheer lack of communication and status updates about Legion, I'm starting to get the impression that it didn't get green lit/is still up in the air... Which, I can't help but wonder what you do with an entire development team that went off to make a game without 100% authorization from the higher ups.
Do they drop Legion all together and essentially have wasted an entire year of development to come back to Dust 514? Do they take the White Wolf - World of Darkness route and just fade away..?
Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold. You do realize that CCP has said that no decision has been made about greenlighting a project that is still very much in Alpha stages, right? It's only been 5 months - games take much longer than that to get to a point where it is ready to be greenlit (not a year like you say).
The shift in course started in November when CCP Rouge signed on and Project Legion's development started. Do try to know what you're talking about before you stand at the podium, please.
Duke Noobiam wrote:As a grown man who does software development for a living I am blown away at how many self entitled whiners there are in the DUST community.
I've spent about $150 on this game and I have no regrets. I have no regrets because it's a game I play almost every day and I've derived hundreds if not thousands of hours of enjoyment from it.
CCP owes me nothing. I won't pout and whine and insist that CCP tell me what they are doing when the reality is that I didn't even pay enough money to cover one days wages for a developer.
Unless you commission the work and pay for the whole project, then CCP owes you nothing.
All you freeloaders who play this game everyday while refusing to pay because you "don't approve of the direction CCP is taking" are basically parasites.
For those few who invested significant amounts of money, I can understand that you are disappointed and I want to thank you for supporting the game, but those are the breaks and you should of understood that nothing is owed to you.
You misunderstand the entire point of this thread: We get it, you're defending CCP to the death and using the same rhetoric (herp derp CCP doesn't owe you self-entitled whiners anything). So, allow me to demonstrate in words you can understand:
If they don't show something worth paying for.... We don't pay. If we don't pay.... They're out of a job. If they're out of a job.... There isn't anything to show anyway. It's sound and logical reasoning on the consumers' part.
Who has more to lose here?
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
6710
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 05:17:00 -
[12] - Quote
Operative 1125 Lokaas wrote:GǪ we will no longer be able to trust anything that CCP says beyond the shadow of a doubt. Also, CCP will prove they are the sad also ran of a game company they have fought so hard to dispel.
Go ahead CCP, make a slick video for fanfest about what you'd like to do instead of what you actually have been able to do.
Lol.
Plot twist. Fanfest 2015 is going to be them saying they're stopping development for Project Legion to start up Project Apocrypha, the Xbox One exclusive.
And it'll be a turn-based card game.
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
7410
|
Posted - 2014.12.11 21:08:00 -
[13] - Quote
Joseph Ridgeson wrote:I mentioned it when Legion was first announced: it has the potential to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.
"Hey guys! We are making Legion! It is supposed to be what DUST was meant to be all along! It will be on the PC!" * "Wait a minute... Does that mean that you can't get DUST to be DUST and are stopping development?" "No! DUST will just be different. It will be a lobby shooter." * "So you are bait and switching us. We put money into DUST 514 on the PS3 because you said it was going to be, well, DUST 514. Now you tell us we are playing the wrong game?" "Don't worry. Your investment will transfer!" * "What does that mean?" "*silence for 6 months.*"
So we go crazy. We hate Legion because we are made at CCP for moving the goal post. So now CCP can look at it and go "I guess they don't want Legion" when we do want Legion; we just don't want CCP to handle information release and DUST as poorly as they have.
We need Legion because CCP already said "we can't do it on PS3." That right there should be reason enough for the game to be green light and have everything transfer. Just call it DUST 514 rather than EVE: Legion.
Right. As much as Dust 514 is and will be, it can't survive regardless of how good it becomes. The New Eden Shooter Experience -can't- survive on the PS3 and it was a mistake to release it on a seven year old (at the time) console to begin with.
As far as the transfer thing, I have no idea. All the new BPOs, apart from going against the New Eden spirit in that it completely eliminates the aspect of risk, aren't going to transfer to Legion in the same form anyway. It was announced that all suits (or just the one? CCP Z described it as an 'iron man suit' so who knows) were going to be BPOs and that the tiered system (std/adv/proto) would not longer be a factor. BPOs aren't going to survive the transition, at least not in the sense that they are now, and likewise shouldn't (in my opinion).
But yanno, I'm cool with that, I've always hated the idea of BPOs to begin with because they never cost anything. Well, except real money, but that should never impact the game in the way that it does in Dust 514. I'd be totally chill with BPO's if we had to craft them out of salvaged parts or still paid ISK for them.
Long-Term Roadmap
More Hard Questions
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
7410
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Posted - 2014.12.11 21:16:00 -
[14] - Quote
da GAND wrote:Joseph Ridgeson wrote:I mentioned it when Legion was first announced: it has the potential to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.
"Hey guys! We are making Legion! It is supposed to be what DUST was meant to be all along! It will be on the PC!" * "Wait a minute... Does that mean that you can't get DUST to be DUST and are stopping development?" "No! DUST will just be different. It will be a lobby shooter." * "So you are bait and switching us. We put money into DUST 514 on the PS3 because you said it was going to be, well, DUST 514. Now you tell us we are playing the wrong game?" "Don't worry. Your investment will transfer!" * "What does that mean?" "*silence for 6 months.*"
So we go crazy. We hate Legion because we are made at CCP for moving the goal post. So now CCP can look at it and go "I guess they don't want Legion" when we do want Legion; we just don't want CCP to handle information release and DUST as poorly as they have.
We need Legion because CCP already said "we can't do it on PS3." That right there should be reason enough for the game to be green light and have everything transfer. Just call it DUST 514 rather than EVE: Legion. And onto the platform it should've started with: PC , development wise it'll be the best way to go.
True enough but there is the consideration that we are abandoning the console playerbase that Dust 514 had established, which was a major concern when the Legion announcement came.
Long-Term Roadmap
More Hard Questions
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
7456
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Posted - 2014.12.15 18:51:00 -
[15] - Quote
Alternatively they could just learn from CCP Iceland and not repeat the -same exact mistakes they did-.
Long-Term Roadmap
More Hard Questions
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Aeon Amadi
Chimera Core
7743
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Posted - 2015.01.08 18:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
Heimdallr69 wrote:I love pc but the ps4 would be their best bet. Pc has to many good games for anyone outside of Eve to care about legion.
Perhaps. Then again, PC would instantly have the Eve player base wanting to tap into it, so there's no building of a player base. PS4 would have the same problem as the PS3 in that it would always be limited by the specs that it has and would require a whole new game every time for every next generation of console that followed. With PC, they'd have the same advantage they have with Eve Online in that they could constantly update it independently of a publisher, as much as they want, only being limited by their own capabilities.
Aeon's Links
I don't run MinAssault, I run MAXASSAULT
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Aeon Amadi
Chimera Core
7743
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Posted - 2015.01.08 21:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
Moorian Flav wrote:On a semi-positive note: Something that never existed could never die.
"That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die.." ~ H.P. Lovecraft
Aeon's Links
I don't run MinAssault, I run MAXASSAULT
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